08 – Voices Podcast

Guests: Barclay Bram, Journalist & Fan Popo, Filmmaker

It is estimated that there are between 10 and 19 million, that’s right, million, women in China who are unknowingly married to closeted gay men, setting up a pending crisis for these women and their spouses. The cultural pressures that keep China’s LGBT people hidden are very different than the pressures the LGBT community faces in Western cultures. With no specific religious prohibition on homosexuality, China’s LGBT face pressure to enter heteronormative marriages for entirely different reasons, namely a social security system that relies on children taking care of their parents. If LGBT people don’t get married and have kids, the entire family’s future financial security is in jeopardy. Join us for an exploration of the unique social forces that have created this massive phenomenon, and what is being done to raise awareness of straight spouses and their LGBT partners in China.

Journalist Barclay Bram outlines the issue: “I think what you’re seeing in America, now that gay marriage is being legalized and there’s much more tolerance of the community than there ever has been, you now see this wave of people coming out as gay, even if they’re married and so you’re starting to see the extent to which the straight spouse problem has existed. But the situation in China and India and Africa and across the Middle East is that today, at any age, people feel the need to still get into heteronormative marriages, and that’s a huge problem.”

Guest: Russ Chapman

Today Russ discusses the dissolution of his marriage after the discovery of a love letter from his wife’s female paramour. Russ is known affectionately among Straight Spouses for the humorous and epic grudge against his ex-wife that he has nursed for over two decades. In this heartwarming episode, he shares how carrying that anger has impacted him, how it has both fueled and hindered him, and he encourages listeners to validate their anger, and then hopefully, release it.

In Russ’s own words: “I have not forgiven yet. Me and lies don’t go well together. Anger can be good, and for our newbies, you deserve to be angry…but don’t hold onto it. Being this angry for this long is a lot of work. I don’t want anybody else to be like this. Don’t carry it, it’s a heavy, heavy weight.”

Guest: Alexis Johnson

Today Alexis tells us the story of her father coming out to her, and how that experience both helped and complicated when she discovered her own husband was gay. She talks about the challenge of intimacy in her marriage, and how her ex-husband either avoided or deflected discussions on physical intimacy, leading Alexis to “poke the bear” trying to get to the bottom of their sexual troubles. She shares that her husband labeled her a ‘nymphomaniac’ for desiring healthy and fulfilling sexual relationship, and how that impacted her.

In Alexis’s own words: “When my ex came out it was around my birthday. And it wasn’t him coming out to me, he likes to refer to it as me dragging him out of the closet. And it was one of the moments where I poked the bear. I wanted to, honestly, get laid for my birthday present, and I got rejected, and I was done. And I said ‘what’s going on? Are you cheating on me?’ and he said, ‘no,’ and I said ‘Are you asexual?’ and he said, ‘no I’m not asexual,’ and I did the Hail Mary pass and I said, ‘Are you gay?’ and he said, ‘I think I am,’ and that set the stage for the next year of spiraling out of control, and going up and down and I hit sort of a really bad place, and I was suicidal.”

Guest: Eric Kearsley

Today, Eric describes his personal journey coming to terms with his homosexuality, his misery over acting out sexually outside of his marriage, his determination to come out to his wife, and how their mixed orientation marriage works today. Eric also shares with us the mission of GAMMA, the Gay and Married Men’s Association, who welcome all men who are married to women, but who are sexually attracted to men, whether they identify as gay or not.

Eric describes his own reaction to his sexual encounters with men in the 80’s: “By that time, we were right smack dab in the middle of the AID’s crisis, and so the terror of what I risked, not just my marriage, not just what I felt I owed my wife, but I risked her safety and my safety. And I remember going through these terrible times where I asked myself what would I do if I ever turned HIV positive, and my reaction was, ‘I could never tell her,’ and I would have to kill myself. I couldn’t face my kids, and I couldn’t face her.”

Guest: J.L. King, Author

In 2004, JL King sat on Oprah’s couch and told the world about his life on the down low. As a married man with children, JL exposed his own double life having sex with multiple men in secret. His disclosure rocked the African American community, sparking both gratitude and backlash for exposing the reality behind the façade of his seemingly perfect family life, and the lives of other men in his community. Today, the author of On the Down Low 2is back talking to a new generation about the stigma on gay and bisexual men that still exists in the African American community and clarifying that being on the down low is not exclusive to the African American community, but found in every race, ethnicity, and religious community.

In JL’s own words: The wives “don’t have a choice in living in this environment with this lifestyle. And a lot of guys who live this life, they really look at their wives/girlfriends as cover girls. I mean I loved my wife, but at the same time my sexual desire to be with another man trumped that love for me to take the risks that I took. And sometimes I was like ‘Oh my god I can’t believe that I’m doing this’, and jeopardizing everything, everything that I love and hold dear to my heart just to be with another man.”

Guest: Susan Relic

There are many ways to be in denial. Today’s episode features guest Susan Relic. After 35 years of marriage, she discovered her husband was having an affair. At least that’s what she thought at first. Then she dug a little deeper. Her husband’s sexual partners were exclusively pre-operative transgender escorts. Join us for this discussion at the very intersection of gender and sexuality, and what it is like for the wife who was caught in the middle, stumbling in the dark with no answers.

In Susan’s own words, on the role heterosexual lovers played in her healing: “Rebound sex did me good! It was like being watered…a plant in the desert having water on it for the first time in years. And it just perks up! And my depression lifted…because being starved of touch is depressing…physically it leads to a kind of depression. It’s sensory deprivation. It really was like a gray veil lifted from my life! And every day I wake up and I’m happy I’m not in that anymore!”

Guest: Dr. David Malebranche

On today’s episode, we get schooled in all things related to sexually transmitted infections with Dr. David Malebranche, an expert in HIV and STI prevention and treatment, and associate professor of medicine at Morehouse School of Medicine in Atlanta. Many straight spouses (and adults in general) find themselves dating again at mid-life, post-divorce. Navigating the new landscape of sexual health, risk and safety has changed dramatically in the decades since many of us had sex education, if we even got it. Back then, condom use was usually demonstrated by a gym teacher using a tube sock and a banana! It’s a different world today, and Dr. Malebranche walks us through the need-to-know basics of prevention, testing and treatment for the biggies: HIV/AIDS, Syphilis, Gonorrhea, Chlamydia, HPV, and HSV (Herpes). Tune in, learn, and stay safe our there!

Guest: Dr. David Malebranche

Dr. David Malebranche returns to discuss the differences between identifying as gay and identifying as MSM, or “men who have sex with men,” and what those identities mean from a research and medical perspective. Is it just a semantics? Is there more to it? We talk about when behavior and identity does not seem to align, the straight spouse is often left confused and desperate for answers. We discuss the cultural stigma associated with various terms and identities that influence whether or not someone choses to identify as gay, MSM, or nothing at all.

Guest: Helen Fitzgibbons

What’s the “right” way to respond when your spouse comes out as transgender? Cis-Spouses often hear plenty of opinions on the matter, especially from people who have not experienced the gender transition of a partner. Family members may pressure the cis-spouse to divorce their transgender spouse and cut ties, even if the cis-spouse wants to maintain the relationship. Conversely, the cis-spouse may hear that they are supposed to stay with their transitioning spouse and “love the person, not the gender,” even if that is at odds with their own sexual orientation and authentic sexual expression. Cis-spouse Helen Fitzgibbons created a “Cis-Spouse Bill of Rights” to empower cis-spouses to honor their own experience of their partner’s gender transition, whatever that experience may be.